D wiltshire

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Posts by D wiltshire

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  7

  The Natural Life Cycle of a Religion

  by LoneWolf in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  here is one of the pieces i sent along with my letter to garrett.

  to understand what is referred to by "relative truths" etc., that is explained in its companion piece, "what is truth".

  i'll post it too, although i hope those who have seen it before will forgive me for posting it again.. lonewolf.

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  D wiltshire

  Tom,

  Clearly well said!

  Organizations try to pigeon hole us.
  I don't think I'll ever let someone in authority ever tell me how or what to think, after breaking free of WT mind control.
  I think for myself or at least try hard to and feel the need to question pretty much most of what people try to sell me. I know in doing so you come off as offensive, especially if you ask question they don't like, well so be it.

  Any Organization in my estimation, has the priority of self preservation and self promotion. With that priority how could any Organization be primarily intrested in the TRUTH which has nothing to do with its primary self interest.
  
  It's true that there are humanitarian Organizations that do good for the poor.
  But show me an Organization that is primarily interested in the TRUTH,.. to its own disadvantage,.. of self promotion or preservation?

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
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  24

  Letter to Garrett

  by LoneWolf in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  36929 row river road.

  cottage grove, oregon 97424. .

  ernie garrett, elder.

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  D wiltshire

  Tom Howell,

  I concider you my spiritual brother.
  I think you are going to really get them thinking.
  Tom in your open letter you sound like a man that has lost most of his fear of men, I can tell.
  That's why I want to call you my brother.

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
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  15

  A Note For 'Wiz' And Other Wizards

  by hillary_step in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  wiz, their religion is just a formalism to buy their way into heaven hopin' that little ol' saint peter will let them through the pearly gates.. i have started a new thread on an issue that i think some might want to comment on.

  the quote above is taken from a recent exchange that took place on englishmans thread that dealt with his families attitude toward his disfellowshipped situation.. i did this not to highlight a personal failure, but because it is typical of comments that the average jw would make.. have you ever stopped to think how harmful the propagation of the, 'we live - you die, we good - you bad'' mentality is, for the thinking and emotional well-being of the jws as a group.

  in fact, i have noticed in recent times that the wts itself, has been reigning in on some of the expressions of exclusivity that they have previously encouraged, worldlings for example, recognizing the harm it does to their cause.

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  D wiltshire

  Thanks HS, you make some sobering points, you are one of favorite posters (well most of the time,)

  This issue of Judging is to me serious one.
  Jesus said in the sermon on the mount basiscally to stop judging people and concentrate on our own flaws then we won't be hypocrites.
  He associated with prostitutes, and sinners of all sorts, these people felt comfortable around Jesus. In fact I never read an account where Jesus said to shun anybody, which fits with the picture the 4 gospels paint of his personality.
  He said he came not to help healthy persons(self-righteous) but for the sick(sinners who recognize they need help).

  WT taught JUDGING:

  1)Sinner confesses voluntarily his sin to elders instead of help, gets public humiliation if sin is known by some in the congregation(public reproof), or he may be cast out from the group as wicked through Disfellowshipping.

  2)A person dating a worldly person is marked.

  3)A baptized JW finds a contradiction in the WT teaching and speaks of it to a friend who reports it to the elders and get DF'd because he won't recant.

  4)Some one is seen going to an R rated movie.

  5)A brother wears a beard((rebelleous spirit of the world (hippy)).

  6)Sister with slit in skirt.

  7)Father lets his son go to college.

  8)One has too many worldy friends.

  9)Sisters husband in the military and she gets a job working in the PX.

  10)Brother doesn't wear a tie to meeting or in feild service.

  I can go on and on,.. on and on,..on and on.

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
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  11

  Creationist Red Herrings

  by Abaddon in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  everytime i hear someone say anything about how there are 'no transitional fossils' (fish-amphibians, amphibians-reptiles etc.

  ), i generally ignore it.. why?

  because if they say that, it tends to indicate the person saying it has restricted their research to pro-creation sites that generally repeat one of the classic fifty or so creationist arguements.

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  D wiltshire

  Abb,

  Thanks for the site refference I will give it a look.
  I'm not what you could term a "creationist" but would be intrerested looking at your 50/50.
  Will you ramdomly be choosing the 50 creationist veiws or will you just be looking for their weakest points?
  Reguardless I'm sure you will do a good job.
  I too have seen some pretty absurd stuff from creationist.

  To be fair there are many who beleive in a creator but don't accept creationist reasons for a basis of their beleif.
  I think you will be able to make them look very silly.

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
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  26

  Revelation 7

  by RR in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a few weks ago, the bible student group i affiliate with had their annual convention.

  the convention itself has been uplaoded to the net.

  there is an interesting panel discussion on revelation 7 on the identity of the 144,000 and the great crowd.

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  D wiltshire

  Yadirf,

  If you send that letter off to the WTS they are going to DF you.
  Especially if you post their reply on the internet.
  I think you are going to be very disapointed at what happen after you give them that letter.

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
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  5

  Answers on a postcard to....

  by josephus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  this is a tough one.. what makes a thing bad ?.

  is it possible to determine?.

  thoughts please.. josephus

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  D wiltshire

  Right and wrong is hard to absolutely define.
  Circumstance and motive play a large part in defining.
  We all have a inner conscience that lets us know what is right or wrong much of the time, but not all the time.

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
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  68

  How we Know that Evolution is a Fact

  by JanH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  there has been a number of threads related to evolution in the last month or so.

  some posters, like penn, subscribes to a form of creationism, which i for this purpose will define as denial of large scale evolution (sometimes called macro-evolution).. even saner people sometimes alleges that scientists are unnecessarily 'dogmatic' about evolution, and that this is 'just a theory.

  ' these people may be recent exjws or jws, still believing the watchtower propaganda against evolutionary science, or accepting similar claims from various fundamentalist preachers and groups.

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  D wiltshire

  Abbadon,

  Referring to your post on Prions.

  I knew that.(just kidding)
  I didn't mean to imply that I beleived it shattered evolution, I just brought up the quote to the thread since it seems to come from a person who has a good reputation in the Scientific community.

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
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  8

  7th Heaven the American TV Show?

  by D wiltshire in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  how do you think the actor for the rev.

  erik camden does the part of a true christian?

  not only the actor but the part he playes.. .

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  D wiltshire

  Yadirf,

  Why don't you watch the show it's on WB monday nite, and tell us what you think?

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
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  14

  Ex-JW Baloney Detection Kit

  by Mindchild in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've been busy moving today but enjoyed reading the debates over evolution vs. creationsism.

  what i thought of when reading all this is that ex-dubs are in a desperate need for baloney detectors.

  the borganization has kept the average witness in the dark so long that when they come out they seldom have the skills or knowledge to see past their own conceptual reality.

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  D wiltshire

  Larc,
  The need for disclaimers, I think should be used judiciously.
  I only feel the need to point out that a little more honesty in areas where great leaps of faith our concerned.
  As I'm sure there are many respected scientist that have opposing theories originating from the same accepted facts that lead some to the most popular theories of evolution.
  I don't know about you, but the longer I live, and the more I learn the more I realize I, or anyone else don't have all the answers. When I was young I felt more sure of things that today cause me to laugh at myself.
  Being a JW for almost 30 years and then to find out I've been had is a real eye opener.
  This CULT experience has caused me to examine more what people tell me, and what I will keep as good, and throw away as bad, or maybe save for the future to examine when it's time.

  I no longer accept on weight of Authority something as true.
  There is a certain joy that comes from trying to be a free thinker.

  My mind wants answers but not in the form of your stupid if you don't beleive this, but in the form of this seem reasonable at least for now until I find out other wise. Scientific theories change as more facts come to light, and even old facts are understood differently in time, sometimes the old facts are disguarded because they were not facts at all but observation that were faulty.

  Take junk DNA it is been taught as fact.
  True it seems very probable to me that it may truly be junk DNA.
  The question is: Is it really junk? Do we know enough about DNA to read it correctly and make that statement with 99 to 100% accuracy?
  Well we have to start some where, so base our conclusion on the supposed fact that it is junk.
  Then 100 years latter along comes more facts that debunk this junk DNA fact.

  Larc, I have a question for you and other scientifically minded persons: Do you beleive or at least conceed, that there could be life far more advanced than ours, from other parts in the universe, that caused the miracles that are reported to have happened in ancient times?
  Or what about the possibility of a life form more advanced than ourselves that started life on earth in the form of a single cell that could evolve?
  Are these theories to ridiculous to be even concidered? If so why?

  Part of me wants to know definitly and part of me says life is so interesting because, there is so much you don't know.

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
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  14

  Ex-JW Baloney Detection Kit

  by Mindchild in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've been busy moving today but enjoyed reading the debates over evolution vs. creationsism.

  what i thought of when reading all this is that ex-dubs are in a desperate need for baloney detectors.

  the borganization has kept the average witness in the dark so long that when they come out they seldom have the skills or knowledge to see past their own conceptual reality.

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  D wiltshire

  Mindchild,

  I'm not putting down science I realize the many things that have been discovered that add to our better understanding of our universe.
  I don't reject evolution I just feel that many put too much faith in the theories that,((let me qualify),(not all theories))have weak spots that require leaps of faith.
  People can beleive what they want, but it you teach it as proven fact, that is misleading.
  I know of these problems that scientist have to work with and I applaud them for their hard work.But you must agree that to try to pass something as a written in stone fact can be very misleading to the average person, that's one reason why I question.

  The vast complexity of all the life on earth fills me with awe. The more science learns of these things, and explains, the more awe I feel.
  I think there must be something to this evolution theory since scientist are continually making new finds that add to the validity of the theory.
  But I don't buy the whole (popular)theory of evolution. When I say popular I mean there are variations of the theory, don't scientist have different version of what they concider to have occured?
  If that is the case it is premature to say "case closed".

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?